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[happy_doughnut]

*waves* Hi, everyone!

Well, because the "tell me about yourselves" thread seems to be going slightly off tangent with this issue, how about a thread for it alone, eh?

Originally posted by ssjtrunks
Why is it the girls always seem to go for the jerks?[/i]

Good question.

For a long time, I've wondered the same thing, and not just why females do this, but why males do:

Originally posted by fantasytiger
then why do most guys end up talking to a girls chest all night long.

... and other things.

Basically, why is it that "nice guys" end up being alone without a partner for a longer period of time, as opposed to the "jerks"? What is jerk? What do you consider a "nice guy"?

Why do males say that they want a girl who's "kind and intelligent", but have their actions contradict them?

What do men and women really want? If what they desire are these physical attributes, why not be upfront about this?


... Or, do you disagree? And, dear forum pal, what do you want?

Go on. Chop, chop!

EDIT:

I hate when guys look at you instead of listening to what you're saying when you're talking to them, and I am bothered by the fact they're so obsessed with breasts and so on. I can accept it, but when they clearly exaggerate I am seriously annoyed. But to tell the truth, there are girls who nearly do the same with other anatomical parts when talking to guys, or that find attractive guys for these anatomical parts only, but they pretend it's because of their charming ways or because of their attitude or thanks to their sweetness, and won't admit it because girls are too "delicate" to admit something like that

lol!
Oh, dear Fortune-sama... that was the most brilliant post I've ever read! Absolutely genius! *claps*

[Spank-A-Thon]

Ahhh, the eternal question "Why do nice guys/gals come last?"... And sadly it's one I have much experience with... Allow me to explain.

I would consider myself very popular with the ladies. On any given night out I can be found being greeted by many different girls and ladies - and to a casual observer it could be said that I appear to be somewhat of a 'stud'... However, nothing could be further from the truth...

I have many female friends and I'm always being told that I'm kind, that I'm sweet, that I'm nice, easy to talk and so on and so on. I can hold intelligent conversations, I can laugh and act childish with the best of them, I'm a good listener and can make a girl laugh...

One would think that this would be enough - but no... apparently it's not. I hear my female friends complain about how such and such a person doesn't do this thing, how they wish their partner could act differently - and all the while I sit there thinking "You're describing me"...

Case in point, a friend of mine was going through a hard time (as was I) and we ended up helping each other. I'd listen to her and she'd listen to me. On many occasions she would complain that she wished she had someone she could just sit with and talk to for hours - which is exactly what we'd been doing anyway...

I wouldn't consider myself to be hideous or anything, but I would also not consider myself good looking - and therein lies the problem... Everyone is obssessed with the physical side of people - yet no one is willing to admit it.

The media bombard us with ideals of what attractiveness is. Adverts are based on sex - "Wear this product", they scream, "and you can have sex with attractive people"...

I'd like to say physical appearance doesn't bother me - but I can't, I would be lying. I admit I may be more flexible with my tastes than certain people but there are still physical attributes than I require to be truly attracted to someone.

I have been out with thin girls, I have been out with girls who could be considered 'plump' - but all have had some physical attribute that I was attracted too. I do know people who won't look at someone unless they're model-like - but that's not me, but that doesn't mean I don't have 'standards' so to speak...

In my 28 years of life thus far, I have found that those who may be considered 'less attractive' have the strongest and more interesting personalities. Maybe it's because us ugly people need to compensate for our 'physical deficiency' but I know for sure no matter how 'beautiful' a person may be perceived to be - I won't go out with them if they have a bad personality.

To summarise, it is my experience that 'nice people' are those who are not considered to be 'conventionally attractive' by the massess and hence have a deeper personality to compensate. But in a world where phsyical appearance reigns supreme, the 'nice people' (like myself) will always be overlooked or consigned to 2nd, 3rd or 4th place in the pecking order.

- S

[Vicious_2003]

I think its mainly the younger girls that go for the jerks (Im talking 16-23). They like to be rebellious towards thier parents and what better way than to go out with a guy thier parents will hate. And for many that idea just sticks and they develop a taste for the jerks

And I think with the older women it becomes more about what THEY want in a man, wich may or may not be that tough guy image.

And heres a hint ladies. If a guy doesent listen to you and talks to your chest all night. Please, open your eyes and realise he is only out for sex. Its something guys do that is gisgustingly obvious that most women cant detect for some reason. And then they wonder why he doesent call the next day (DUH).

Everyone is obssessed with the physical side of people - yet no one is willing to admit it.

How very, very, very, true. And it amkes sence too. The physical side of a person is the first thing you notice, so of course if thats the first thing on your list about a person it will be the first thing you either like or dont like about them. And if you dont like how they look, it turns you away from that person. So you never get the chance to know them as a person. Physical attraction is VERY important in a relationship

In my 28 years of life thus far, I have found that those who may be considered 'less attractive' have the strongest and more interesting personalities. Maybe it's because us ugly people need to compensate for our 'physical deficiency' but I know for sure no matter how 'beautiful' a person may be perceived to be - I won't go out with them if they have a bad personality

I dont think its because over weight or un attractive people have to compinsate with a good personality. I think its just that attractive women develop a thing I like to call Vanity. Now there isnt an attractive women alive that would admit to this, but its true. Date one and youll see. The more attractive they get the more vain they usually are. They get it in there head that they can controll you because there so beautiful you wont leave them. And sadly sometimes thats the truth, they can. Theyre used to getting what they want and that usually leaves them void of any character or a good personality because they dont need it. They can be a complete bitch and get what they want so why be nice ?. Im telling you, an attractive girl with a great personality, its every mans dream and they are VERY VERY VERY rare.

Why do males say that they want a girl who's "kind and intelligent", but have their actions contradict them

A mans idea of a wife and a girl he would date are two different things. Im going to go ahead and let out one of mans age old dating secret that no women is meant to know. Any guy you date knows within the first half hour of talking to you weather or not your the girl he is going to marry some day or a girl he just wants to sleep with. There is no in between.

Again, I dont think nice people have to compensate with good personalitys. I just think attractive people's personalitys degenerate over time due to a certain amount of Vanity. And of course as with EVEYRTHING there are always exceptions so dont post about the one person you know who is both cute and has a good personality.

[neomarik]

ive known lots of nice girls, but thn they always say...my boyfriend has to go to court...or.....he smokes weed...or...he steals cars....and im like, does that turn you on or somthin? dont you want someone who treats you nice, and around to do so?

[Berserker]

A lot of girls find dangerous guys incredibly attractive, why do you think serial killers in jail get a lot of female mail.

[neomarik]

i think they maybe mentally unstable

[Berserker]

It seems that people always want what they can't get/have...

[neomarik]

what do you mean?

[MakgSnake]

I dont think that they finish last.....you have to be in the right place to finish first. It all depends where you are and live.

But if you are too nice for the envoirnment then I guess you might not even finish.

[Cannibal Clown]

18 years old, never once had a girlfriend, or even a girl who was at all interested in me. That's something that can really bring down someone's ego. I've always beena nice guy, kind, concerning, generous, a gentelmen when the time calls for it, and every time, the prep, jerk, guy with big muscles, lot's of money, better car, and cocky friends always seems to get the girl. It's bull shit. I had a conversation with a girl that i liked about this issue, and she agreed, that generally a girl will lean toward the one who will make her seem or feel more wanted/popular/cool.

Even though they want that sort of guy who actually cares for them, and won't go on a testosterone ego trip in front of every other guy, they still seem to always need that sense of a stereotypical "man" to be by their sides. As a sort of look that they have to live up to.

To me, it seems that the kind of guy a girl wants relects the kind of guy a girl's friends would mostly approve of, or even be jelous of. And it usually gets worse the more attractive they are. The hottest girl in school, will go for nothing less than the coolest, most attractive, jock in the school. Usually just to live up to their social standards.

I've never been considered one of the "cool"people. And i was never a shop rat, never physically inclined at anything, not suave, or intellegent, or loaded with cash, good car, or a car at all for the most part, or able to put into any sort of class. I was the annoying energetic person who always became redundantly bothersome. But i was always a very nice and sweet person. And all of the girls who knew me saw it. This one girl, who was already in a very deep relationship with another person told me the honest truth, saying that i am a very nice and kind person, that if i tried i could easily make a girl very happy, but (yep, there's a but) my all about personality, and the things that come with being me, scares girls off, and "I" as a person, will always find it very hard to get a girl in any way.

That kinda killed my ego, froma girls perspective, me being a good guy, and the kinda person that every girl truely does want, will never get what i want because i'm not what they want. Damn it.

So i have to agree, nice guys finnish last, or sometimes, like mentioned before, never finnish at all.

[Vicious_2003]

Dont feel bad Cannibal. I can somewhat relate. Im 19 and I havent dated sence High School. And even then I didnt date very often. I had a few girls ask me out and I asked a few out myself, but that was about it. I never took dating very seriously in high school because I knew I was way too young to commit to anything serious, and I knew the girls were too. Weather they realized it or not. (Again, age matters to me)

The fact of the matter was that girls in my HS never had much more to talk about than cloths and school gossip. Two things I could care less about. Phone conversations were usually rather awckward and quiet. So im taking some time off of dating and waiting a while untill im ready to commit to a serious relationship. Then, hopefully I can find a girl who is interested in more than meaningless things. My main goal in life is to have a nice home, a good wife, a dog, and a couple kids. The american dream so to speak. I dont think im asking too much out of life, it seems like every other person I know has acheived this and doesent appreciate it's worth

[Qjij_jijQ]

I dont think im asking too much out of life, it seems like every other person I know has acheived this and doesent appreciate it's worth

Seriously... If I ended up like that, I wouldn't be happy either. I think the only word that comes into my mind when I think about that lifestyle is: Boring. I don't actually care about my relationships with other people, because from my personal point of view, the best part of life isn't with other people.

... and I think that, in a weird way, it's kind of true that you tend to want something / someone more when you know you can't have it / her. Right now, there's a girl that's "after me" at work and even though I'm somewhat flattered... I think it makes her a lot less attractive when she acts too desperate.

BTW, I'm not saying I want to go out with girls that are "not enterested", but I think I'm a little bit more attracted on a physical level to those girls.

[goodman]

As you get older you will find that women dont change much in the way that you may currently have a problem with them. I find that many of the women i talk to are pretty materialistic and their main priorities are their kids and their jobs. If you happen to be an attractive, well employed, male who wants to have kids and all sorts of other things that the female desires, then they may want to talk to you. Im actually having more success with women older than me who have gotten the "kid thing" outta their life and have time to spend with a quality gentleman who actually knows how to live and have fun in life. Trust me, guys, dont wait too long to meet someone because if you do, they will have all kinda things they want to weigh your life down with, and things that you probably wont want to take on seeing as your trying to make a success of yourself, which is hard enough... But if you catch someone who hasnt already gotten into a bunch of prior commitments and potential snares, then you have the possibility of having a continuing relationship with that lady. Its tough, but its well worth your while, to take the time to get to know someone well before you invest much in the way of emotional and other forms of support... Think of it as a job interview, find out who and what your getting yourself into, you will respect yourself more and very possibly the lady will respect you more also...

[Vicious_2003]

Seriously... If I ended up like that, I wouldn't be happy either. I think the only word that comes into my mind when I think about that lifestyle is: Boring. I don't actually care about my relationships with other people, because from my personal point of view, the best part of life isn't with other people.

I dont think it would be boring at all. But thats just me.

[Qjij_jijQ]

If this "American Dream" is what you want...
... that's A-Okay with me!

I just feel as though I need more than that...

[Gadzoox]

I freely admit that a lot has to do with looks. BUT the thing is, if someone is 'unattractive', but has an incredible personality, I tend to grow to be attracted to them physically as well.

For example there's this guy I used to work with and when we first met I thought he was just a regular guy, not 'hot' by a long shot, verging on homely. But after I got to know him and how hilarious he was, I found myself attracted to him, and now, well I don't work there anymore and I still find him as hot as ever! ^^ So unless his face physically changed or something, i'm counting that as my prime example. (too bad he has a girlfriend already..)

I dunno... there also has to be a spark too... I have a few really attractive, charming guy friends who I haven't even really considered as a partner, maybe because there wasn't a 'spark', or at least I didn't see one.

I think the best thing to do is just bite the bullet and ASK them if they would go out with you, not as a friend. Just ask! Chances are they've never even considered it, maybe they didnt see a spark, but are willing to give it a try... you'll never know until you ask! And who cares if they say no, you asked and found out. Be strong and get out there and ask!

Anyway, I'm babbling and probably not making any sense, and most positively going off topic.

[Berserker]

Originally posted by neomarik

what do you mean?

A lot of girls don't want the guys that blindly admire them and take whatever they throw at them, they want sort of a challenge in a relationship. It keeps the tension going I think. In a relationship you have to be equal and it can't consist of one person worshipping they other without getting it returned somehow. Don't know if this makes sense it's kinda hard for me to express myself correctly in english concerning the matter.
But the grass is always greener on the otherside and when a person can't get another person it makes them somehow incredible attractive and desirable.
It's all my opinion of course...

[Redpyramidhead]

Originally posted by Gadzoox

I freely admit that a lot has to do with looks. BUT the thing is, if someone is 'unattractive', but has an incredible personality, I tend to grow to be attracted to them physically as well.

That sounds a lot like the way I look at it, but I admit that for me that they have to be a little bit more than 'unnattractive'. And, like you say...there is usually some kind of spark that I look for in a girl both in looks and personality.

I dunno... there also has to be a spark too...

I went on a date with this girl i met online a couple weeks ago...she was very attractive physically, which I could tell right off the bat as soon as she walked out the door when I picked her up. She had even seemed to have an interesting personality online. When I started taling to her on the phone I wasnt so sure about her, but at the same time I was intrigued by her unique personality so I went through with it.

The point of this story is that she was actually a nice person in many ways, but her kindness and maturity were somehow not clicking with my kindness and maturity. The reason was because she did not see any need to accept anything about who I was because due to events in her life she felt that anybody expecting to be accepted by her was like forcing themselves to be intimate with her. That was her hangup. In reality, it was just wanting to be able to talk with her and get to know her better. I wanted to get to know her and have fun talking abotu life, but she was completely incapable of communication, leaving her almost painful to try and talk to. Annoying as hell. I talked with her on the phone a lot and one of my strangest habits is wanting to help people, but she would almost talk to me like I was a peice of shit for trying to. She did not think that was a valid way to spend one's time and she sure as hell wasn't going to let me waste her time with it. That along with her assumption that I must have thought I was all high and mighty to think I was in a position to do so pretty much just constantly brought me down when I even thought of her. Anyways, I finally told her I could not handle trying to communicate with her and I wasn't going to waste my time while I could find somebody who actually wanted to find me as interesting as I did them. I may have been hasty in my choice, but I almost never tell people off like this and I am much more patient with them, but she would not allow me that same patience.

OK, here's the point: If you are a nice person and you happen to run into another nice person, that doesn't mean that those two nice people will be able to get along, because there are different kinds of nice people. Most of them are nice in different ways and have their hangups in others. You will either realize this right away or it may take a long time and you could end up well into a relationship with them by then. (PLus, most people make judgements of others more quickly than people who are more kindhearted so they may think they have figured this out right away.) This is one reason why it is twice as hard for two nice people to be able to find eachother and become a couple that clicks and will survive. Also, if somebody decides they don't like you, it could be because you have too many hangups or they have too many hangups that make it impossible for both of you to reach a certain level of communication. It doesn't necessarily mean that neither of you are in general some kind of a nice person, atleast. It just means that two people aren't compatible.


ON the other hand, yes it is true that most members of the opposite sex will go for those they find more physically attractive first, before they look for somebody who is nice and kind and has a great personality. And, when they think they find somebody with both, they may tend to think they are in heaven. Otherwise, they just want to enjoy getting laid by the most physically attractive creature as possible. It's the painful truth, but it's natural for most people to have that urge for large phases during their lives. Some people do nothing but this, and it's disgusting, but even somewhat decent human beings do it occasionally as well.

I am 23, I don't have a girlfriend right now, but I will again someday and I just have to remind myself not to be in such a hurry because then I'll waste too much constructive time on worrying about finding someone. Of course, thats easier for people to say that have people come up to them all the time and show interest first when they go out place, but I have to try anyways, even though I seem to be ignored most places I go. Otherwise, I'd be my own worst enemy. I've done it to myself in the past and I don't want it to bring me down anymore.

A lot of you are quite young. Younger than me, even. Let me be the first to tell you that you have plenty of time to find somebody. There will be somebody out there who appreciates somebody nice. Don't waste your time waiting and being depressed about being "alone" like I did. Just do what Zoox said below and *shrug* it off when it doesn't work out and keep going.

I think the best thing to do is just bite the bullet and ASK them if they would go out with you, not as a friend. Just ask! Chances are they've never even considered it, maybe they didnt see a spark, but are willing to give it a try... you'll never know until you ask! And who cares if they say no, you asked and found out. Be strong and get out there and ask!

The world of finding somebody will always be a cruel, cruel world and let me admit that it has indeed been very cruel to me and I have complained about it to the sky and vented about it to the people I know over and over again, but I won't let that define me.

I don't know if anything I said was helpful, but I hope it was to somebody at least.

_RED_ stuff

[goodman]

Ive read through from what Zoox, Berserker, and Red had to say, and its true that there is no hurry in making a choice in someone because of the fact that the right choice you make wont be one that is made in haste. Oh, and Berserker, what you were saying is true here in America as well as your own country... I think part of the reason that its so hard to make a match between two people is that people are quite selfish nowadays, and simply dont want to take the time to get to know someone, they want to do what they want to do, and when they want to do it... So although i do suggest that a young person try to meet someone they are compatible with before they get too old and most of the people out there are strung out peeps in dire situations, its smart to pick and choose those that you do consider, which is hard sometimes when your lonely and desiring to be in a relationship. Yet, the heartache you save yourself is better than the heartache you create for yourself by getting involved in a bad situation from the start... Im dating someone nine years older than myself and putting up with some noticeable quirks, and im sure she is with me also, there is a lot of give and take in a relationship, if peoples main concerns are themselves then they will end up by themselves eventually...

[Chara]

Well, here is a theroy of mine: Nice guy/girls are great for relationships and possible marriage whicle bad guys/girls are good for a quick thrill. We all want a quick thrill but as with all great things, too much of it will wear thin after a while.

I consider myself a nice guy, I can get bad boy at times but for the most part I'm a nice guy. During my 4 years at highschool many girls have approached me but nearly all of them I was just friends with. I wouldnt call myself sexy but apparently it was my looks that drew them in and my nice guy personality drove em away. According to girls I am a nice guy to talk to but that pretty mcuh it. I dont see how the hell that is possible since I am not one to talk much. Hell, I dont even like talking on the phone for more than 5 minutes.

But I have seen these girls go out with jerks that I really am not too fond of. Pretty much the complete opposite of me. But of course they break up after a month or so. As I said earlier, that quick thrill.

So nice guys like me may be husband material but not boyfriend material. That is if you can understand that... cause I dont even really know what I'm talking about.

Bah, but what do I know? I've been girlfriendless for years.

But as for the the looks in relation to someone's personality, yea the hotter someone is the more crappy thier personality is. I've seen this more in guys than girls, though. I know this girl that has a washboard stomach, nice booty, nice sized breasts, long flowing blonde hair and a face that would make pamela anderson blush but she doesnt has the typical airhead personaility. As a matter of fact she is quite interesting. But nearly all the guys I know that are good looking and know it, they are basically jerks.