Here it is, MGS4 scans

[Vic Viper]

http://premium1.uploadit.org/dsn2000//1126695259037.jpg
http://www.videogamerx.net/gamenews/usernews/bonobono/a001/161/mgs4_01.jpg
http://www.videogamerx.net/gamenews/usernews/bonobono/a001/161/mgs4_02.jpg

they made snake looks so Old. i dont like it. :frust:

Otacons model looks cool though. :lick:

[dan da man]

WTF, why the hell does Snake look older than George Bush, my arse not having that, get it right Kojima pleaseeeeee. :D

Other than that nice news vic.

[kupoartist]

lol, that's so silly that I like it! Great things come with moustaches... Charlie Chaplin, Scatman John... err... the Turn-A Gundam... ok, he should lose the moustache, but Snake as an older guy isn't such a bad idea...

[Qjij_jijQ]

Awesome pics... hate the moustache!
... and what's with the eye patch?

Guess every Snake is destined to get one sooner or later.
( there's only Liquid left and we're all set! )

Kojima DID say that the story somewhat 'ended' with MGS3 and that was something else, right? It looks like it's in the future... or something.

... can't wait to get some more info.

[Vic Viper]

no its not an eye patch, its a visor that connects to that robot he has with him.

look..

http://www.videogamerx.net/bbs/data/usernews/1126707531/02.jpg

lol, that's so silly that I like it! Great things come with moustaches... Charlie Chaplin, Scatman John... err... the Turn-A Gundam... ok, he should lose the moustache, but Snake as an older guy isn't such a bad idea...

i hate teh mustache..it has to go.. :laugh:

[Qjij_jijQ]

... what a subtle way to spy on people that is :laugh:
Anyways, technically isn't it an 'eye patch' visor? ( the look is similar )

I'm not too sure where they're going with all this.
Well, thanks for the info Vic. It's good to know there are at least 'some' fans left 'round here. *shifty eyes*

[kupoartist]

He kind of looks like Dick Van Dyke in Diagnosis: Murder...

[Phenom]

they made snake looks so Old. i dont like it.
LMAO. You make it sound like you don't like old people.
Guess they gotta grow old in some point of time.
Although I do hate the mustache.
Nice pics.

[Qjij_jijQ]

I just found some more information...

on Gamespot:

Surprising trailer will show an older soldier that resembles Solid Snake, hinting at a futuristic timeline.

Director Hideo Kojima's trailers for the Metal Gear Solid series have always contained surprises. Back when Metal Gear Solid 2 was first shown, audiences at the Tokyo Game Show were fascinated by the high-quality graphics rendered in real time on the PlayStation 2, with some visitors mistaking that it was a prerendered movie. Metal Gear Solid 3's trailer teased gamers by hinting that it would take place during the Cold War, making everyone wonder who the main character was. The trailer for Metal Gear Solid 4 that will be shown during the Tokyo Game Show 2005 this weekend will undoubtedly surprise fans of the series once again.

It's only a matter of days before Konami shows off its first real trailer of Metal Gear Solid 4 at the Tokyo Game Show, and the latest issue of Famitsu disclosed preliminary details on what event attendees will be seeing. As gamers may expect, the trailer will show how Metal Gear Solid 4 will be the most realistic-looking MGS yet, thanks to the PlayStation 3's high-quality graphics.

But the greatest change in Metal Gear Solid 4 may not be on its surface. In what may come as a huge surprise to gamers, screenshots in Famitsu show a character resembling series hero Solid Snake--as an elderly man with gray hair, wrinkles, and a moustache. Though the older man hasn't been confirmed as Solid Snake, he seems to have all the hero's trademarks, including a gray bandana, a muscular physique, and the habit of smoking cigarettes. The man wears a mechanical patch on his left eye (making him look similar to Metal Gear Solid 2's Solidus Snake), which seems to be a high-tech scope connected to his new small mech partner, Metal Gear Mark II. Metal Gear Mark II looks identical to the robot that appeared in Konami's classic game Snatcher, one of Kojima's early works. A screenshot from another scene shows a man resembling Otakon, who looks like he's in his 30s or 40s.

Other screenshots hint that Metal Gear Solid 4 will take place in a desolate, futuristic city rather than in a jungle like Metal Gear Solid 3. Soldiers, tanks, and two-legged mechs are seen on the roads. Talking to Famitsu, director Kojima confirmed that Metal Gear Solid 4 will take place in a war zone. The game will feature multiple countries waging external wars and suffering from internal strife. Kojima plans to add realism to the relationships between Snake and the countries to make it more than just a simple character-enemy relationship. For example, if Snake kills a soldier from one country, he may end up allying with its opponent.

Kojima says that he hopes to make Metal Gear Solid 4 more "natural" than previous installments in the series. With the hardware shift to the PlayStation 3, the developers will be able to give natural motions and facial expressions to the characters--eliminating the need for exclamation points to appear above soldiers' heads when they recognize something.

During the Electronic Entertainment Expo, Kojima said that he wanted to develop elements that weren't "visible by the eye" in Metal Gear Solid 4. He revealed to Famitsu his plans to include "mind games," which will have opponents' concentration depend on their mental condition. For example, soldiers may become weaker if they get intimidated.

For fans of Metal Gear Solid 2's Raiden, Kojima confirms that he will be making a comeback in Metal Gear Solid 4.

GameSpot will have more details on Metal Gear Solid 4 from the floor of the Tokyo Game Show.

Some of this looks quite... interesting.

[Urahara Kisuke]

I just found some more information...

on Gamespot:

Surprising trailer will show an older soldier that resembles Solid Snake, hinting at a futuristic timeline.

Director Hideo Kojima's trailers for the Metal Gear Solid series have always contained surprises. Back when Metal Gear Solid 2 was first shown, audiences at the Tokyo Game Show were fascinated by the high-quality graphics rendered in real time on the PlayStation 2, with some visitors mistaking that it was a prerendered movie. Metal Gear Solid 3's trailer teased gamers by hinting that it would take place during the Cold War, making everyone wonder who the main character was. The trailer for Metal Gear Solid 4 that will be shown during the Tokyo Game Show 2005 this weekend will undoubtedly surprise fans of the series once again.

It's only a matter of days before Konami shows off its first real trailer of Metal Gear Solid 4 at the Tokyo Game Show, and the latest issue of Famitsu disclosed preliminary details on what event attendees will be seeing. As gamers may expect, the trailer will show how Metal Gear Solid 4 will be the most realistic-looking MGS yet, thanks to the PlayStation 3's high-quality graphics.

But the greatest change in Metal Gear Solid 4 may not be on its surface. In what may come as a huge surprise to gamers, screenshots in Famitsu show a character resembling series hero Solid Snake--as an elderly man with gray hair, wrinkles, and a moustache. Though the older man hasn't been confirmed as Solid Snake, he seems to have all the hero's trademarks, including a gray bandana, a muscular physique, and the habit of smoking cigarettes. The man wears a mechanical patch on his left eye (making him look similar to Metal Gear Solid 2's Solidus Snake), which seems to be a high-tech scope connected to his new small mech partner, Metal Gear Mark II. Metal Gear Mark II looks identical to the robot that appeared in Konami's classic game Snatcher, one of Kojima's early works. A screenshot from another scene shows a man resembling Otakon, who looks like he's in his 30s or 40s.

Other screenshots hint that Metal Gear Solid 4 will take place in a desolate, futuristic city rather than in a jungle like Metal Gear Solid 3. Soldiers, tanks, and two-legged mechs are seen on the roads. Talking to Famitsu, director Kojima confirmed that Metal Gear Solid 4 will take place in a war zone. The game will feature multiple countries waging external wars and suffering from internal strife. Kojima plans to add realism to the relationships between Snake and the countries to make it more than just a simple character-enemy relationship. For example, if Snake kills a soldier from one country, he may end up allying with its opponent.

Kojima says that he hopes to make Metal Gear Solid 4 more "natural" than previous installments in the series. With the hardware shift to the PlayStation 3, the developers will be able to give natural motions and facial expressions to the characters--eliminating the need for exclamation points to appear above soldiers' heads when they recognize something.

During the Electronic Entertainment Expo, Kojima said that he wanted to develop elements that weren't "visible by the eye" in Metal Gear Solid 4. He revealed to Famitsu his plans to include "mind games," which will have opponents' concentration depend on their mental condition. For example, soldiers may become weaker if they get intimidated.

For fans of Metal Gear Solid 2's Raiden, Kojima confirms that he will be making a comeback in Metal Gear Solid 4.

GameSpot will have more details on Metal Gear Solid 4 from the floor of the Tokyo Game Show.

Some of this looks quite... interesting.

Sounds pretty cool. Hopefully though if that is Snake he looses the moustache. >.<

[Qjij_jijQ]

Yeah... the more I look at it, the more I hate his face.
He looked so damn cool on the original 'teaser image'... too bad.

BTW, am I crazy or is it a fact that Snake has some type of problem that makes him grow old faster than regular people ( since he's a clone )?

[TtTackler]

This has made my DAY. Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees.

[Qjij_jijQ]

For some reason, I don't want to believe that this is Solid Snake.

When we saw the original "teaser image", with most of the cast, Solid looked like he had half of that guy's age... who ever he is. I'm no expert in the whole MGS mythos, but is it possible that this is Solidus, at the time he was at war? ( where he found Raiden ) Could it be that, since we already played as Solid and Big Boss, a part of this game would be played as Solidus, to further 'explain' his background?

Maybe his visor could get blown off at one point, which would explain why he has an eye patch in the other game. Later, we could have Solid come back to this place ( since apparently, the action takes place in a war zone ) and he would have the opportunity to do what Solidus didn't??

Anyways, I'm just not feelin' it... an old Solid Snake?
I prefer ( by far ) the one that was shown on the teaser image, which seemed a little older than in MGS2 and sportin' a cool battle beard! :D

BTW, check in Vic's first pic... in the upper right corner, he seems to be injecting something into his neck. Some kind of medicine? drug?

Also, in the last pic ( which is more of a concept art ), at first I thought it was a weird foot we were looking at ( right ), but now it looks like it's someone's left hand, with a kind of retractable knife attacked to the forearm. Quite interesting... well, to me at least.

[dan da man]

Raiden, he's making a come back then, cool, never understood why there were so many haters of him lol.

Can't wait for the video of mgs4, always wait for this years after years. :lick:

[Qjij_jijQ]

CaN'T WAiT 2 SEe ALl thE NeW bAD GUys!

HmMMm... i DOn'T FEeL S0 g00D.
i BeTTeR LiE d0Wn, 2 MuCH eXiteMeNT! :shappy:

[Vic Viper]

the trailer should be coming soon, either tonight or tomorrow. :lick:

oh btw heres what the kojima said about Raiden:

Raiden will also return, series producer Hideo Kojima reveals to the magazine. The new Raiden will apparently be so cool that you'll rethink your opinion of the Raiden from MGS2. The TGS trailer will give us a first look at Raiden's next generation debut.

[Qjij_jijQ]

^ YEah, i ReCaLL REaDiNG thAT S0MeWheRE.

i'M HaPPy aB0uT iT. i DiDn'T 'reALly' liKE Raiden iN MGS2, BuT i Th0UGht hE HaD a L0t 0F PoTenTIaL 2 bE aWeS0ME.

[merylsilverburg]

According to the text on the right in the first picture link, the man is Snake (unless it's all false information to throw us off and in reality, it's Big Boss...maybe he never died and was cyrogenized or something). I was able to translate a little of the text and this is what I got:

With the PlayStation 3 beginning to form in the real world, we are showing the first strong impact of "man" (I think the phrase meant that the idea of "man" equals strength and that is what the PlayStation 3 is proposed to do. So, the article is relating the PlayStation 3 and MGS4 with "strong impression"). The face (I think) has grown old and the body is unbecoming to it. The clothes is familiar and unique and see the bandana (I couldn't see one of the characters in the page so I couldn't translate it).This man is indeed Snake. He is the aged "Solid Snake" as expected. I couldn't translate the last part because of one character.

So, that's all I got from it. If this man is really Snake, I have to admit that I am very sad that Snake has become an old man for this game. I don't have a problem with old people, it's just that...old people depress me. I feel that they should retire and relax comfortably instead of having to go through all this vigorous and straining ordeals that's more suited for the youth who can take the hits. I know that Snake still is all fit and in shape for that age (I mean, my God, look at him! He's still busting out the CQC moves!) but I just...don't like it. :( I don't mind the mustache...though he looks a little like Ocelot.

Okay, so now...I have a question. Do you guys remember that "line-up" picture that features sketches of Snake, Raiden, Meryl, Ocelot, "Naomi" and that old guy with the eyepatch? Okay, well, if the old guy with the patch is supposed to be Snake, then who's the youthful looking Snake-look-alike standing next to Meryl?

I don't know what to make of the injection picture...unless that's the new "rations" for the game (you inject this needle in order to survive or something...it is futuristic after all). Otacon looks much better now that he's older. As for Raiden coming back, let's just hope he isn't as whiny as he was in MGS2...hopefully he's grown up a bit.

Oh and Metal Gear Mark II...:disturb: I don't know what to make of him. He reminds me of that little robot character in "Star Wars"...uh...R2-D2 or something. I wonder if he's more helpful or more useless. It seems like it's going to be a challenge trying to play a stealth game with a little robot with you all the time.

Great pics Vic. Do you know which Japanese magazine this is? I would like to pick up a copy, if possible.

[Vic Viper]

its from the famitsu magazine meryl.

gamespot has a new info on the game, discribing the trailer.

Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots (http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/adventure/metalgearsolid4/preview_6133382.html?q=1&tag=gs_ps3_flashtop_bg)

[merylsilverburg]

Famitsu, eh? It's probably sold out, lol. Thanks for the link too...I love the title "Guns of the Patriots." Wow...the name alone sends shivers down my spine. :D

I forgot to add my opinions on the futuristic setting of MGS4. Personally, I don't really like the futuristic enviroment...I normally don't like futuristic stuff anyway, with a lot of mecha or machinery so I don't know how happy I'll be with this setting (I think this is why I enjoyed MGS3 so much).

[Qjij_jijQ]

^ P00R LiTtLe meryl :weep:

STiLL, u Do BRiNg uP a G00D P0iNT ThERe...
WhaT iF tHE Y0uNG Snake iN ThE 'teaser image' iS ACtuaLLy tHE 1 aND 0NLy Big Boss tHAt hAS BeEN bR0UGht BaCK 2 LiFe ANd iS acTUAllY G0iNG 2 Be THe BaD GUy iN thE GaMe?!?

... WhiLE wE'Re stUCk beiNG oLD... ANd CRanKY... aND wEaK. XD

i KN0W iT's FarFETcheD, BUt i'M JuST TrYiN' 2 bE 0RIgiNAl.
iF ONly hE DidN'T HaVe a STUpiD M0uSTaCHe, iT W0ULd bE aWeS0ME.

[Vic Viper]

http://www.gametrailers.com/gamepage.php?id=1743

the quality is a little bad, taken from a home video camera.. :mean:


anyway, all i can say is HOLY F***, theres just nothing else to say. best looking next gen game yet. That was freaking unbelievable. :blink: :blink:

[Qjij_jijQ]

D0WnL0aDiNG iT RiGht n0W! :happy:
( HmmMm... WaS ThiS P0St NeCeSSAry? )

ANyWayS, i'LL EDit mY C0MmENts laTER.

EDiT:
F0R STarTeRs, iT's eXtreMELy weLL D0nE! i W0uLD 0F LiKed 2 SEe M0Re 'ST0Ry 0RiENted' MaTEriaL, BuT i'M STiLL QuiTE iMPResSEd.

BeST PaRt: GRaPhiCs.
W0RsT pARt: Solid Snake's DaRn M0UstaCHE!!

[Phenom]

I didn't bother downloading that because I saw it on tv. (Attack of the Show) To see that on a big ass screen. All I can really say is motherdamn. Graphics were off the chain.

I don't even care about the mustache any more. I just want the damn game.

[Qjij_jijQ]

i'M ReaLLy H0PiNg 4 aN "0uT 0F thIS W0Rld" kiNDa GaME... aND SinCE iT IS 'suPP0Sed' 2 bE tHe LAsT 1, i'D liKE EVeryTHiNG 2 bE pERFecT. As 0F N0w, Solid Snake's M0uSTacHE iS ThE M0St AWefuL pArT 0F thE GaMe.

ANY0ne KN0ws whEN we'LL heRE m0Re 0N tHiS?
ThERe aRE S0 mAnY ThiNGs tHe TRaiLeR LeFt 0Ut...

[Vic Viper]

i'M ReaLLy H0PiNg 4 aN "0uT 0F thIS W0Rld" kiNDa GaME... aND SinCE iT IS 'suPP0Sed' 2 bE tHe LAsT 1, i'D liKE EVeryTHiNG 2 bE pERFecT. As 0F N0w, Solid Snake's M0uSTacHE iS ThE M0St AWefuL pArT 0F thE GaMe.

ANY0ne KN0ws whEN we'LL heRE m0Re 0N tHiS?
ThERe aRE S0 mAnY ThiNGs tHe TRaiLeR LeFt 0Ut...

yeah, they didnt show Raiden. :frust:

[Qjij_jijQ]

^ DidN't Kojima sAY ThAT wE ACtuaLLy WerE suPP0SeD 2 SeE hIM iN ThiS TRAiLer?

PLuS, i'D LiKe 2 SEe S0Me dARn BaD GuYS!
ThEY're My fAV0RiTE PaRT 0F tHE gaME... USuaLLy.

[GameMind]

cool.. is it released yet?

[Phenom]

cool.. is it released yet?
Lol. No. Ps3 isn't even out yet.

[Qjij_jijQ]

I made some quick calculations, based on some information I found on the net and apparently, Big Boss was about 48 years old when he fell into a coma and they decided to clone him.

If my math is correct, he should've been about 75 years old in MGS2.
( I say "should've been" as he's apparently dead, of course )

Now, in MGS2, Solid Snake looks like he's about... 40? But, he is in fact 27 years old, which means that he's growing at about 1.50 ( 1.481 to be precise ) times faster than normal humans.

In MGS4, he looks like he's around 60 years old, so technically, the events in the game should be taking place about 13 years later, which would make Solid Snake 40 years old. ( We're in 2012-2013 then )

I've heard that clones tend to grow faster, since they are made from 'older' cells, but is the growing process supposed to be accelerated even after the clone has reached the actual age of the person it was cloned from?

IF that's not the case, Solid Snake would've stopped growing older faster at the age of 32-33 years old, at which he would look like he's actually 48 years old. This would mean that the events in MGS4 would be taking place almost 30 years later!

[Qjij_jijQ]

^ Can't edit your post twice?
Anyways, forget what I just said... here's the real numbers.

After the attack on Pearl Harbor (1941), Big Boss wanted to join the army, but was apparently "too young" to do so. He then decided to lie about his age, in order to be able to get accepted. This means that he was, at the most 17 years old ( let's say that's how old he was )

In 1941, Big Boss is 17.
Then it means he was born in 1924.

He was cloned in 1972, when he was 48.
... and he 'died' in 1999 in MG2: SS, when Solid Snake was 27.
( Which means he 'died' at 75 years old )

In MGS, Solid Snake is 33.
In MGS2, Solid Snake is 35.

If we say he looks about 45 in MGS2, it means that he's aging at the rate of 1.29 times that of a regular human being. So, since he looks like he's 60 in MGS4, it means he's actually 46-47 years old. In that case, we can say that the events in MGS4 are taking place about 11-12 years after those of the previous game.

In that case, in MGS4, we're in 2018-2019.
Does that seem reasonable to you guys?

[GameMind]

INTERESTING :D, but doesnt matter, still dont like his white hair :D, btw is this means in MGS5 he`ll be 80 or something? and in MGS6 he`ll be died and they`ll make a copy of him!? :D

[Phenom]

^ I heard this was suppose to be the last Metal Gear (could be wrong... Kojima do like to pull alot of peoples legs), or were those questions a joke to add in a little humor?

[MakgSnake]

Hey guys, sorry have been offline from this website for almost an year. Things were different, and they were just crazy. I hardly came online at all. Neways, I cannot say that I am back now, as I dont know whats going on with my life. All I can say is that its good to see this website, and see people I once knew too well. It still is an amazing place to be...too many memories I have here.

So yeah back to the topic of this thread.
Solid Snake, yes he looks old and as Qjij_jijQ explained, he is aging pretty fast because of the DNA process. Kojima "kinda" confirmed that the game IS TAKING place around 10 years after the BIG SHELL incident.

As for how Snake looks, I think he looks great, and people do not worry if you dont like the new Solid Snake imagery because remember when screenshots of Sons of Liberty were out back in 2000, people thought he looked wack or not so good, but now its perfectly fine. Just like that his image, his looks will grow on to us, thats the magic of Snake, Kojima and Yoji Shinkawa.

But ONE POINT to be noted, in his latest interview, Kojima mentioned that if people complain too much about Solid Snake's new "old" looks, he just might redo his appearence and make him look younger, but he decided to make him old because he has better storyline for that AGED Snake and that he wanted to challenge himself and his staff to create an older looking protagonist, because according to him anyone can create a character with nice and shiny skin with no wrinkles and all (Dead Or Alive 4 anyone). So yeah..... I think Solid Snake looks great and I will like his new looks even more, the more I look at him (And no I have not turned gay in the time period I left these forums).

CAN NOT WAIT

As for Metal Gear Solid 5 and 6, Kojima also confirmed that SNAKE might not be the lead character in the Metal Gear games in the future at all, may be Raiden might take over, or whoever directs those game decides whos the main character of Metal Gear games now.

Honestly, I dont want Solid Snake the main lead character if Kojima is not making those games, because the other directors might ruin Snake's character or something, so someone new and fresh should be just fine.

Oh and Kojima also said that "WE" would LOVE Raiden this time around in Guns of the Patriot, cause hes making him way cooler and more rugged, which I knew it all along from before. I like Raiden and cannot wait to see the new and imporved version of him, I think he'll be the new Grey Fox, who knows.

[merylsilverburg]

As for how Snake looks, I think he looks great, and people do not worry if you dont like the new Solid Snake imagery because remember when screenshots of Sons of Liberty were out back in 2000, people thought he looked wack or not so good, but now its perfectly fine. Just like that his image, his looks will grow on to us, thats the magic of Snake, Kojima and Yoji Shinkawa.

People thought Snake looked horrible in MGS2? I thought it was a good look for him because it made him look more mature, wiser, and experienced.

But ONE POINT to be noted, in his latest interview, Kojima mentioned that if people complain too much about Solid Snake's new "old" looks, he just might redo his appearence and make him look younger, but he decided to make him old because he has better storyline for that AGED Snake and that he wanted to challenge himself and his staff to create an older looking protagonist, because according to him anyone can create a character with nice and shiny skin with no wrinkles and all (Dead Or Alive 4 anyone).

Yeah, I read that interview too. I don't know how much younger he might make Snake if everyone's response to him isn't favorable though. Thing is, I don't mind the whole "look" to Snake (he looks quite dashing actually), but I just don't like seeing or thinking about old people in general, that's the problem I'm having right now with the elderly Snake.

As for Metal Gear Solid 5 and 6, Kojima also confirmed that SNAKE might not be the lead character in the Metal Gear games in the future at all, may be Raiden might take over, or whoever directs those game decides whos the main character of Metal Gear games now.

Um...why bother with MGS 5 and 6? I love this series as much as the next fan, but they really shouldn't carry on, otherwise the series could fall into the "tired franchise" category *cough* "Tomb Raider" *cough*

[kupoartist]

Um...why bother with MGS 5 and 6? I love this series as much as the next fan, but they really shouldn't carry on, otherwise the series could fall into the "tired franchise" category *cough* "Tomb Raider" *cough*
that's always a risk, but TR 1,2,3 and 4 compare very poorly with MGS 1,2,3 and 4. There were no really big leaps made in the Tomb Raider games ever, we were playing the same game again, and again and again, no matter how the level designers dressed up and textured each "tomb" as a different locale (venice, the jungle, the arctic: they're all tomb-like) - the MGS games should be commended for their utterly distinct feel, their ability to keep it fresh. Sons of Liberty wasn't all that different, but Snake Eater was frankly such a turn-around for the series that I'm confident that the series is far less likely to grow "tired". MGS4 looks like another unique twist again, and you know what? He may look faintly like Magnum PI in a sneaking suit, but I damn-well like Snake's new look.

[MakgSnake]

Um...why bother with MGS 5 and 6? I love this series as much as the next fan, but they really shouldn't carry on, otherwise the series could fall into the "tired franchise" category *cough* "Tomb Raider" *cough*
Hmm, I agree Tomb Raider is a pure example of ruining a franshise with too many sequals, but there is also Final Fantasy that has gone till XII, I know every sequal has its own storyline but still.

Metal Gear Solid is a the BIGSHOT for Konami, and I believe they'll try making the most profit out of it till they can. I mean if "Test Drive" series is still running and coming with the 7th sequal I suppose, why cant Metal Gear?

And Kojima being the Vice President of Konami Entertainment Japan Tokyo, he said he'll make sure that Metal Gear series will always be watched by Kojima himself no matter who directs it.

[merylsilverburg]

that's always a risk, but TR 1,2,3 and 4 compare very poorly with MGS 1,2,3 and 4. There were no really big leaps made in the Tomb Raider games ever, we were playing the same game again, and again and again, no matter how the level designers dressed up and textured each "tomb" as a different locale (venice, the jungle, the arctic: they're all tomb-like) - the MGS games should be commended for their utterly distinct feel, their ability to keep it fresh.

I wasn't exactly comparing the "TR" series with "MGS" on a literal basis; I know these series are completely different in genre, story, and so on, but what I meant to do was just compare the idea of a long-running franchise that appeared successful in the beginning, but slowly diminished in popularity and/or style/good taste. Of course, obviously, "TR" went downhill much faster than "MGS" but there is the possibility that the same fate could happen with the "MGS" series, one will never know.

Sons of Liberty wasn't all that different, but Snake Eater was frankly such a turn-around for the series that I'm confident that the series is far less likely to grow "tired".

Please don't get me wrong. It isn't that I want the "MGS" series to end. I mean, right after playing "Snake Eater" and thinking that this was the supposed "final" game to the series, I was severely depressed for a few days. Because, as you said, "Snake Eater" was a complete turn-around and it was incredibly fresh in all aspects of the gameplay and the story/character development were much more emotional and complex than the previous games. So, I was really upset it was the last one. But, once I heard there'll be a fourth game, I was thrilled.

But the idea of continuing the series and without Kojima in the director's chair left me sort of doubtful and fearful. Yes, it's possible the new director and/or the new team might make the future "MGS" games as much a success as the formers, but what if they don't? They might feel the pressure to live up to the name of the series and Kojima's legacy, so they'll wreck their brains trying to figure out an outstanding plot that'll blow the previous ones away and, as a result, the whole thing might come out convoluted and messy. Or they might not be able to keep the spirit or the style of the series as Kojima intended. Then the gamers who supported the continuation of the series will begin whining and bitching, "Omigod, what happened here?" or "This is not what we want! What's wrong with them?!" or "This game sucks! Why'd they make more?" and blah, blah, blah.

This is exactly what happened with the "Tomb Raider" series. Gamers wanted the series to continue and with the non-linear plot, it is so very possible to continue the series successfully as long as they stick with the elements that made the first game shine and a great story. But no. Gamers wanted more, they wanted more features, more clothes, better graphics, and so on. Then what happened? Everything started getting sour. Gamers complained...but some still bought it. And yes, I realize that CORE became greedy, stupid, and lazy, so they figured they already made a successful franchise so they can just cheat consumers out and I know that Kojima or the future director/team wouldn't become that way(hopefully) so there shouldn't be any worries and I shouldn't compare. But, if CORE had the same passion as Kojima, they really should've:

a) left the series at number 2 or 3
or
b) continued, but made the games unique and fresher than the formers.

So, what I'm trying to say is, too much of a good thing can be bad. Why not just leave the series at it's peak popularity or it's peak success? As in, letting gamers remember the games as a real legend, a real classic. And, as I said earlier, even though the future "TR" games were horrendous, some still bought it. Do you really want the outstanding "MGS" series to turn into something cheap like that? And yes, as I said, the future team might not turn money-greedy, but you'll never know. They might put out something mediocre, but just because it's the "MGS" name, people will still buy it.

Wanting more isn't bad, but it's because I love this series so and admire Kojima so much that I just want, excuse me if I'm being selfish, the games to be directed and done only by Kojima and his current team. Which is why I worry. And of course, I could be wrong in all that I'm saying; the future games might turn out fantastic and if that's the case, then I'll be very happy and admit that I was wrong in my doubts.

EDIT: Also, may I add that people might not care so much for the "MGS" series as much as some of us. I mean, "MGS3" didn't even win "Game of the Year"...instead, that honor went to "GTA: San Andreas"! Honestly, not being all fanboyish here, but it just goes to show that people prefer something involving random shooting and profanity instead of a game with a real passion running through its veins.

and you know what? He may look faintly like Magnum PI in a sneaking suit, but I damn-well like Snake's new look.

Alrighty, I don't know if you're being hostile with this phrase, but I don't really mind old Snake, but I just don't like thinking about old people in general because they depress me so. Maybe I am just uber-sensitive to the needs and the idea of the elderly, but the idea that Snake is "aging" to this state, makes me fear and saddened at the fact that he could, well, very well die. Okay, so maybe it's really the idea of the death of a legendary hero that saddens me moreso than the elderly aspect and the oldness is just enhancing my fear. Oh God...Kojima won't make him die in "MGS4" will he?!?! :weep:

[kupoartist]

Alrighty, I don't know if you're being hostile with this phrase,
people have a bad habit of interpretating my intensifying phrases and randomly-addressed interrogatives as personal attacks :P I don't even remember you talking about the old Snake, so I can't have been addressing you

All age groups should get their own video game hero. Will Snake die in MGS4? It has to be a possibility, I mean Kojima almost seems to be preping Raiden for something... But sooner or later Snake is going to die anyway. It's probably far better that he goes before the game falls in danger of going stale like you said... I'm still not sure with the Tomb Raider comparrison though, simply because it's a series that I have always felt was stale with the very first sequel. The difference between the reaction to the Whiners between MGS and TR is that Kojima productions has never worried about them all that much whilst Core pandered left right and centre and cookie cut their games from the beginning. Even if Kojima leaves, I have faith in the team to keep the series to a good quality, and wind it up at an appropriate time. After all, there is only so long that the series can even feasibly go on for. The timeline is pretty damned full :)

[Harry]

I agree. I have always thought that "heroes", in any kind of myth, must eventually die, disappear, go away at the right time. I am honestly disgusted by Square Enix's FFVII revival, something that is justified in my opinion by nothing more than marketing reasons.

Game publishers want to re-use the same characters forever for many obvious reasons; game directors and authors must know when it's time for a change in the series. Kojima is not an average developer. He is an author, and he has gained enough freedom to do what he thinks is best for his series. I also sense Snake "must" die in this game, like many of you - only if Kojima believes Snake has still something to say, a dramatic role into the series' storyline, he will let Snake survive this adventure.

Snake cannot live forever because he is not just an "action hero", one of those modern action movie characters that can be reused forever; he is closer to a tragic hero, one that from the beginning of his journey, next to his almost superhuman strengths, has already those limits that will eventually lead to his end, like Liquid, Solidus, or Big Boss.

This said, I do not think the series must necessarily end with the next game. The myth Kojima has created is complex enough to offer a thousand different developments, in the hands of the right people. I cannot hide Konami, despite the company's idiosyncrasies and occasional criminous lack of control on some key projects, is probably my favorite game developer, so I have faith in their work on future Metal Gear games.

But I would love the series to change its name after MGS4, to create a distinction between the past and the future - and eventually between development teams lead by different directors.

[kupoartist]

I am honestly disgusted by Square Enix's FFVII revival, something that is justified in my opinion by nothing more than marketing reasons.
to add insult to injury, Advent Children revives several characters with very little purpose other than "ooh... won't the fanpeoples love to see X-Character in CGI?!". It's a lame marketing gimmick of a film, and I must say that my trust in Square-Enix is at an all time low...

[Harry]

to add insult to injury, Advent Children revives several characters with very little purpose other than "ooh... won't the fanpeoples love to see X-Character in CGI?!". It's a lame marketing gimmick of a film, and I must say that my trust in Square-Enix is at an all time low...

Same here. Even though the director of the next Final Fantasy is good enough to make a game that could revive the interest of old fans of the series, I fear Final Fantasy XII might just be an exception (even though the sexy-bottom-centered character design is in-line with Final Fantasy X) to let Square Enix's main creative team gain enough time to prepare their first "next generation" Final Fantasy.

I do not believe Kojima will ever sell out, and give up to this kind of strategy. I loved MGS2 because it was a punch in the face of the public of the previous game and an amazing game at the same time; it's this kind of creative bravery, of intelligence, that I expect from Kojima, nothing less.

[merylsilverburg]

people have a bad habit of interpretating my intensifying phrases and randomly-addressed interrogatives as personal attacks :P I don't even remember you talking about the old Snake, so I can't have been addressing you

Oh sorry, it's just I did mention my thoughts/feelings on the old Snake earlier in this thread and I think I'm the only one who dislikes the old Snake for the reason that he is old rather than just the visual aspect.

All age groups should get their own video game hero. Will Snake die in MGS4? It has to be a possibility, I mean Kojima almost seems to be preping Raiden for something...

You've got a point there, Kojima does seem set to put Raiden into the mix permanently...otherwise, he wouldn't have created him and put him through the MGS2 "training."

But sooner or later Snake is going to die anyway. It's probably far better that he goes before the game falls in danger of going stale like you said...

Well, I know that Snake is going to die sooner or later...after all, all of us humans have an expiration date, if you will. But, for me, I much prefer if Kojima allowed Snake to live at the end of MGS4 but he just retires or goes off somewhere while Raiden (or whomever) takes his place. That way, I don't have to actually see Snake die. It's much more emotionally shattering for me to see a favorite person of mine pass away at the moment, rather than the assumed idea that they pass away in the future. A good example of this would be (I'm sorry to throw a different subject in here) but the anime Rurouni Kenshin. It's naturally assumed at the end of the TV series that things end well and peaceful, but in 2002, they created a new series that revealed the death of the main character...in the worse way possible (contracting a disease...excuse me?). I don't know why I have this problem of mine, but I've always felt this way ever since I was a child.

I agree. I have always thought that "heroes", in any kind of myth, must eventually die, disappear, go away at the right time.

For me, the heroic death thing depends on the circumstances or the situation at hand. Such as in "Legacy of Kain: Defiance"...even though I was pretty depressed too (I didn't expect an ending like that...I was very naive), it was more of an "understanding-sadness", even though I would've preferred a different fate for the anti-hero.

Snake cannot live forever because he is not just an "action hero", one of those modern action movie characters that can be reused forever; he is closer to a tragic hero, one that from the beginning of his journey, next to his almost superhuman strengths, has already those limits that will eventually lead to his end, like Liquid, Solidus, or Big Boss.

Ah see? There, that's the problem...because Snake is more of the tragic hero, it becomes even more tragic that I (and I use myself strictly since it seems I'm the only one who isn't thrilled with his fated death :laugh: ) have to see him die! With what you said above, I'm already nearly tearing up...only because what you said is very much the truth and I hate to admit it. :weep:

But I would love the series to change its name after MGS4, to create a distinction between the past and the future - and eventually between development teams lead by different directors.

This is a good idea and I would like that too. But would the new name still include some kind of "Metal Gear" in the title? Or will the future games have something else other than the Metal Gears...another new mecha-weapon, perhaps? It'll be interesting to see what the next teams decides to do.

Oh dear, I'm afraid this thread has swayed into another topic entirely. :laugh:

[MakgSnake]

I agree. I have always thought that "heroes", in any kind of myth, must eventually die, disappear, go away at the right time.
I am not too sure about "Die", but disappearing sounds very intresting to me. Snake is a kinda of human who we all can expect to disappear forever. But then again....like you said Harry, he isn't our typical Super Hero or anything, that he would around all the time and wouldn't age at all just like Archie. So yeah........Disappearing would something I would like because I dont think I can see him Die....... Nooo, Snake..?..Snake!!?!! Ssssnnnaaaaaakkkeee!!!!!! *Tear*.

[SniperWolf]

Oh... I don't like "Old Snake." He can't be as old as he looks. How many years after MGS 2 does this take place?

[DragonSphere]

Thought I'd sum up recent news:

- Official Release Date! - June 12 2008
Let the countdown begin!

- MGS4 Playstation 3 Bundle (sometime in June?)
Containing 80 gig PS3 plus DualShock 3

- DualShock 3 Release - April 15th, $54.99

What a way to begin the summer, eh?

[General Q]

I think this game has serious potential, like all MS games. Do ireally think this will be snake's "last mission"? probably not. it would be a terrible idea to let the franchise go after all this success...but maybe, like seinfeld, its best to leave at the pinnacle, not on the downward spiral...the preview at http://www.gamesabyss.com/index.php/previews/16-playstation-3/33-metal-gear-solid-4-guns-of-the-patriots-preview seems like a pretty solid game to me overall...The close-quarter combat stuff seems pretty intriguing, and any improvements made to an already solid franchise can only help, IMO.