American Anime (Why not ?)
 

Its always puzzled me why more american Animators dont get into doing anime(Or atleast in an anime style format). I know anime originated in and is considered a Japanese thing but still dont american animators realize the greatness of this format. I mean is crap like Ed Ed and Eddie the only thing they see as profitable. I realize that anime isnt so hot in the U.S but youd figure there would be a few americans brave enough to venture into it besides the Brothers behind the Animatrix. It seems to me that It could be made VERY profitable if done right. I mean we could get rid of all the emotional face distortions that plague Jappanese animes (Like when Kenshin gets hit on the head by something and his face becomes a perfect triangle and then his eyes swirl around and he grows whiskers !. I mean what the hell IS THAT anyway) . And ofcourse if it were actualy aimed at entertaining an american audience it would surely become more appealing .

I agree with you Vicious. I've always wondered the same thing. Me and my cousin were debating over better animation styles. I said I prefer japanese animation over american style becasue of the detail and the quality. My cousin said that he liked american style animation, like Todd Mcfarlane's Spawn series that was played on HBO. He said Anime just gets too annoying with the whole face/head distorting and the big eyes. I agree that is the thing that turns me off most about anime, but it's just the style I can live with it.

I like spawn the animatted series . But it was confined to HBO and I never really got ot get into it. And it was less about real fighting and more about strait sluaghtering people. Id just like to see it become more popular . We in america seem to think that animation is just for kids...when clearly the jappenese know otherwise. I cant wait till the REAL networks like NBC, ABC, and Fox air an anime series..if that will EVER happen. Or hell if not that then an anime network of some sort . Something.....anything !

1) I think the facial distortions are funny...especially the ones in Kenshin, they're done correctly.

2) American animators don't make anime because...they...aren't Japanese. Anime is short for Japanese Animation...so how could an American animator make it? It would probably suck if they did make it, anyways.

1 - What the **** is Ed, Edd and Eddy?
2 - 'anime' could mean just a shortened form of Animation, it doesnt say Jamine or Jap amin which is what it shud be if Japanese people made it it could be Namine or summat fro America it does not have to be Japanese only and American animators are brilliant at their job.
3 - Yes, facial expressions from Japanese anime gives them a lot of credit. It gives it a special twist when somebody gets hit on the head with something and their eyes just happen to turn into a twirl and little drops of perspiration fly off their head as they stagger around before dropping to the ground in a dusty heap.

To me, its the same deal with Champagne, unless it was made in Champagne, France, Its not Champagne.

I think Spawn is pretty good, isnt most of the Team for Spawn Japanese anyways? Ill watch Spawn tonight and check the credits..

Yes americans can do anime and no I dont see how you can say it would suck. What does your nationality have to do with it ?. Ive got some great Ideas for anime series that I think could be very good and im not jappenese.I see anime as more of a style. But as I said it is generally a jappenese thing and it did originate there. The only reason id like Americans to get into the anime style of animation is because Id like to have acces to it more and not have to get dubs at sun coast (Video Store). I wouldnt care what nationality the people who made it are as long as it gets played in the U.S. I mean saying that americans cant do anime is almost racist. Its like saying white people cant make Chitluns or do Rap Music :laugh: ;) . Having to wait for the voices to be dubbed and for it to be purchased by Cartoon network just aint cutting it. (And I know I could go out and buy the box sets but im poor so it aint gonna happen). Alos Ed Edd and Eddie is a stupid Cartoon played on cartoon network im just using that as an example of what is sadly the more popular form of animation here in the states . Also i keep my stance on the retarted looking facial expressions..I think it ruins the moment,... I mean your immersed in this great animation and Background detail and then out of no where a characters face turns into a geometrical shape and they have the mouth of a cat (not to mention most animes have a serious tone to them that is ruined by this) . Thats just a little bit too wierd for me. I think the shows would be much MUCH better without it...and I certainly dont see how thats funny...it certainly has never made me do anything but cringe.

Nice analogy, I don't think I could have come up with something like that. Anyway, I don't mind the whole thing about the character's faces becoming perfect geometrical faces. Don't you think that would make it even just a little easier to draw? I wouldn't have a problem with some american animators adopting the anime style, I think it would be interesting to see.

You guys just aren't hip to the cartoon cartoons. Those are some of the best shows on TV. I find Ed, Edd, and Eddy to be rather funny. Johnny Bravo, Power Puff Girls, and Dexter's Lab are all good. I laugh at your inability to find these shows funny! BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA ok done.

There is a thing called Japanime, I think. That is short for Japanese Animation. When we look at the big book of Anime term brought to you by ZeroSniper we see that the definition is this:

This fact was brought to you by: ZeroSniper's big post of frequently used anime terms

Which further raises the question of what would you call an American style of anime. :blank: Just plan old American Animation? Or an Action Cartoon? Or perhaps settle a deal with Japan. We give them something they want over here, be it military secrets or women, for the rights to call American made shows anime. That is, if they have the rights.

But when we go to websters we see that it doesn't clearly state if it is Japanese or if it doesn't matter.

Which raises the question of who cares? THE VIEWER. Yes, people will watch if it is Anime. Even if it looks terrible. But if you call it a cartoon they turn their head away and watch more anime. We are talking serious dinero here people. I mean, would Cowboy Bebop be so cool if it was a cartoon where little kids could watch?

Maybe I am just being a Baka? Ah, I don't care. Read this, it goes further into the discussion of which is better. Maybe you will read more then a couple of sentences, unlike me. But be warned! It is long with no spacing between paragraphs and it bashes Japanese Animation. And whoever tries to "borrow" the paper will get an F, especially if they don't change the name on it :laugh: Any way my final thoughts are this:

I think that it should just be called Anime. I think that whole thing with wine and champagne is just a clever trick to rip people off. But I hate most wine any way. ESPECIALLY THAT CHURCH PISS! NASTY! Oh no... :good:

I don't think that an Anime Series shown on one the big channels would really help Anime in America. In fact when these Reality shows become unpopular they should turn there. But I don't know how it would hold with some adults. They are just too stupid to understand the deep meaning in it all. And most people like comedy for their TV shows.

I think putting an anime series on a big time network like NBC would help enlarge the fan base here in the U.S for Anime ( Or whatever U would like to call it) . It would show some of these adults that it can be taken seriously. it would give anime some credability. I mean they air those dumb ass reality shows like the new one with the guys in masks and Monika Lewinski, why not show an anime series. But to me and most current anime fans the channel isnt going to make a difference. I just want to see anime and not have to wait for each season to be purchased and dubbed !

Sponge Bob Squarepants? You no like:laugh:

I don't think the American youth would accept anime to well. America is based around public image too much.

Re: American Anime (Why not ?)
 

Plague anime? The whole face distortions and swirly eyes or nosebleeds, etc. that are in animes are just a bit of humor that are supposed to give the series a bit of a light-hearted touch. You will not find something like that going on in dramatic moments. It's only because that's the way the Japanese animators feel it's a funny thing for the audience. In Japan, this is a typical thing to put and is not considered "annoying".

What is wrong with anime stories as it is now? Why does an American anime have to be "aimed for an American audience"? If Americans were more open-minded to different things, then they would be able to accept anime as is instead of having an anime for an American audience. Besides, anime wasn't originally aimed for American audiences to begin with...a long time ago, the US imported animes and it was considered "stupid" and "weird" and "hard to understand". Anime actually became an underground craze instead of being mainstream. And now, just because anime is becoming a little more widespread, people are now saying that there should be an "American" anime. I think it's best to leave things as is, don't you agree? Leave anime to the Japanese because they know it the best.

In Japan, anime basically means "animation"...it doesn't matter what types. Like...for example, "Ed, Edd, and Eddy" would be considered "anime" in Japan because it's still animation. The word, "anime", derives from the French word "animate", not from the US.

I don't think that Westerners should adopt the "anime" style. Why? Because anime right now, just seems to be the "craze" and what happens later on in the future? What if anime becomes stale and "undesired"? What happens then? It's almost like the whole "Chinese" craze that went on in 2000. Martial arts, ZEN, Feng Shui and all that stuff were everywhere. And now? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. There's a virus going on right now called SARS and the news say that it originated in Hong Kong and is now being spread in the US by Asians. Now, just because of this, Americans say "Asians= Disgusting". Where's the "Asian Power" now? Like I said, it's all just a craze and the same goes for anime. I mean, anime right now is still unaccepted by Americans...so unaccepted that people are now rooting for an "American anime" based for an "American audience"? What's that about? What's wrong with just accepting anime as it is right now?
Another thing: the reason why anime/manga is more for the Japanese only is because the Japanese would like to keep it for themselves. Now, this isn't to say that "Japanese people are RACISTS!!" NO. The Japanese have always been immensely private about their affairs and their culture. If anyone knows how the Japanese are like, one can see that they're very private, very reserved, not nosy (with the exception of a few people). It's only now that they "opened up" a little bit and are happy to export anime to the US. However, if a Westerner decides to become a mangaka or whatnot, they are likely to be turned down. Since anime have always been "something within the borders of their own country" they do not feel comfortable for any foreigners to come along and adopt their style. I mean, I know in the US, if some foreigner wants a job or wants to do something, they are able to do it. That's the good thing about the US. But, Asian cultures and other countries have their own customs and rules. It's hard for some to understand what I'm talking about, but I'm Asian so I know what I'm saying.

I'm sorry if I have offended anyone or said some unpleasant things, but remember: I'm not saying that the Japanese are racists. It's just their culture and "way of behavior" that makes them the way they are (not willing for Westerners to adopt the Japanese style). But, if anyone wants to go ahead and try to become an mangaka or go into the animation field in Japan, prepare to face some hardships.

Atcually not to be argumentative but I have seen it happen in dramtic moments in Kenshin. Thier was a part where a guy with a stationary gatling gun was shooting at kenshin and a few others. Somwehere during the scene kenshin was hit on the head and well you know what insued the facial distortions I hate so much. (Sorry i cant name names but I saw it a while ago and I have a terrible memmory. Unless I really commit somehting to emmory its gone within a few days)

Nothing is wrong with anime as it is now I LOVE IT. But you ahve to look at this from the point of view of the networks who would be airing it. I mean whats easier,... getting americans (Many of them arrogant and ignorant toward other cultures) to accept the jappenses culture or just airing animes aimed towards the U.S audience. Sadly its not about whats better neccesarily but its about whats more profitable. I dont like it but lets face it thats fact

Hmm...I dissagree . I dont see anime in the U.S as a craze at all. Most fans of anime in america are dedicated. I dont know many who just tune in now and then. I know for sure that I wotn be getting tired of it anytime soon. And it has been here a while now. I mean DBZ stood the test of time. They could probably run another 5 seasons of it before people lost interest (I know there arent another 5 seasons Im just saying). I dont think Anime is a craze....not at all.

Also Meryl my argument has nothing to do with exporting anime, I mean making our own . The U.S producing its own anime style shows and NOT having to import them all. Also its good to hear from someone with an asian point of view I never really knew that the Jappanese didnt like the idea of letting the U.S get ahold of too much anime. And i still havent changed my stance on the facial distortions. I dont see how its humorous at all unless your like 5 years old. I think it makes a well drawn character look rediculous when they dont need to. I mean why must everything I watch on TV try and be funny ?. Id rather have no attempt at humor at all than just some weak attempts like having someone get konked on the head. But then thats just me...I prefer realism and having thier faces do that just makes it more unrealistic

You made some very good points, Meryl. It's nice to hear from someone who has a different view and I can see where you're coming from. But it is a shame that we can't get the anime in English faster.

To be or not to be...
 

Firstly, how do u lot in the US get Cartoon Network, do you lot have Sky as well or do u use cable. Secondly, I did not say Ed, Edd and Eddy were bad I just never actually heard of em. Yes some of the cartoons like Dexter's Lab is funny

Dubbing is OK if its the right cartoon thats dubbed. And finally I would like to make my point again about facial expressions. They add their own little twist which shows thats its Japanese and I like the way they do it because if you throw like a hard ball (tennis ball) and throw it at somebodys head you dont see twirls for eyes - so it just shows that its NOT reality - so dont take things too seriously with anime... thats all

Well I guess sence the majority of you like the facial distortions it cant be a bad thing. I guess ill just accept it (Wouldnt really have a choice anyway :laugh: ). But if that many people like it it cant be THAT bad. It just seems like something that would appeal more to the younger audience of which I am not a part.

hm....
 

Some of us may just be a bit young in our mind! I just think personally it makes friction and adds a little spark to the production. Some of those facial expressions appear in younger peoples shows as well such as (I will never mention this in the forums again) "Pokemon and Digimon" (there i said it). Anyways I think it was a good topic to raise this as I think americans and possibly other countries should start to have a go at this.

Ah yes, well I really wasn't talking about just Kenshin. :) I believe there are some other animes that have the facial distortions but during dramatic moments, there really aren't too much of it. But since I don't really mind these as much, I don't really keep track of it, so I'm probably wrong. But, sure, during that episode of Kenshin, he got smacked on the head and did a little face, but it's simply because it's one of those "moments". If you continue to watch farther, you'll see there aren't that many going on in the Kenshin series.

I see what you're saying, I really do. But what I'm trying to say is, why does Americans have to have it their way? I mean, I know it's hard for a majority of Americans to accept Japanese or other cultures, but just because they don't, does that mean that Westerners should adopt the anime style just for Americans? That's kinda unfair, IMO. I mean, if they don't like it, that's their problem....why don't they try to be a little more open-minded? I mean, other countries and cultures love Americans and that's why Americans are so arrogant and they think "Oh, we don't have to accept other cultures becausae America's the best." And I know it's hard for the networks and companies (profit-wise), but making animes for American audience is straying away from what "anime" really is about. Anime is something different, something unique....if people make an American anime for the Western audience, it's not really anime. Because it'll just like any typical cartoons because the plot will be something based for Americans and it'll be simple, not complex like Japanese anime (not all, mind you :right: ). One other thing: it's so unfair why Westerners should take the anime style to make animes to appeal to the American audience. If this happens, then the "origin" of anime will disappear. What I mean by this is: Americans love to take things and claim it for their own. Now, I'm not saying all Americans, but you have to admit...a lot do. So, if there's an American anime and people who are ignorant that "anime originated in Japan", these ignorant people will be like "Oh wow! This style is soo cool!" and think that America started this whole thing. Sooner or later, it'll be all like "Oh yeah, America's animes are the best". I admit that there'll probably won't be that many people like that, since many now know what anime is, but there those people, you know.
Maybe I'm not making much sense...if anyone is confused, please tell me and I'll try to explain more clearly. ^^;;;

Maybe you're right...maybe anime isn't a craze. But to me, since I've seen and experienced some of those "anti-anime" situations, it does appear to be a craze, to me at least. You're right that fans of anime are dedicated...but that depends on which kind of people you're talking about. There are many different types of people: the ones who started watching anime when they're really young and loved it even when it wasn't popular before, the ones who started watching Sailormoon and DB and then started liking anime, and other types. If you're talking about the latter people (SM, DB), then I wouldn't really call them dedicated anime fans. The reason why is because they only started liking anime from watching the shows they aired here and it appealed to them. If you take these people when they're younger and showed them all the older animes (Gigi, Voltron, Astroboy, Cyborg 009, etc.) they're probably like "Um.....". Which shows that they're not "real anime fans", they only go for "the craze of the moment".
I don't mean to "diss off" fans of those series or anything...that's not my intention. I only mentioned those because those type of people aren't really "real fans"...they're fans of anime, but only mainstream. The only reason why I say this is because when I was younger, I love anime...I enjoyed the style, the detail, the art, etc. But since it was considered "weird", there wasn't much access to it and I was only able to get very minimal stuff from Chinatown. And when I started drawing, I drew the big eyes, little nose, etc. and people questioned me "Eww...what is that?" or "Why do they have such big eyes? Are they aliens?" :disturb: I'm sure, if I drew for those same people right now, they'd be like "Oh wow! That's soo great! It's soo pretty!" That's what I'm saying...it appears to be a craze to me.

I think it's good that the US imports anime. At least it's authentic and real. Domestic anime wouldn't really be anime, IMO. And I never said that the Japanese didn't like the US getting too much anime; they're happy to export anime, but they just don't like it if Westerners adopt the anime style because it is originally theirs to begin with and they'd like to keep it that way. I'm sure not all Japanese feel this way, but a majority probably do.

Once again, I apologize if I have offended anyone or said some harsh things. I don't mean to come off that way, but it's just how I feel towards close-minded Americans or people who can't accept anime as they are.

Ahhhh! Asian's don't = disgusting. You just heard some racist bastards speak out, which should be a crime. Too many people are racist in the US. Upset, angry, and jealous. But for every racist there are nice people in the US. Trust me on this, not everybody is stuck up on image and other people's opinions. It's just that some people are.

Like what Weapon said:

I mean, just because most people in this forum think that facial distortions are funny doesn't mean he has to give in to peer pressure.

And Sponge Bob Square Pants is a great show. I don't care if my nephews and I watch it together! I watch it because I like it. And we have cable, that how we get CN. Though you can get it on Satellite.

And Meryl is right about the popularity thing. Game shows used to be damn popular two years ago in the US and now you have to order the Game Show network or stay up late to see one.

I don't think that is the case. I think people in America who enjoy Anime just don't want to wait forever to watch something and understand what they are saying with out having to read for 20 straight minutes. I don't think they want their own style they just don't want to wait that long or learn a new language. I think that a lot of fans of Anime in America could come up with great ideas for new Animes.

I think it is damn selfish to say Anime should only be made by Japanese people. That's like saying Basketball can only be played by Blacks because most good players are Black! THAT IS TOTAL BS AND IT IS RACIST! To blame it on their culture and "way of behavior" is so damn wrong! If that is truly how they feel then I give up watching it! But of course I have to believe you because you are Asian. RIGHT. I am part Asian myself and my grandmother is 100% Asian. Yet I don't claim I know part of everything that is Asian because I don't.

But you know what, I am 100% American. So maybe you don't know what I am talking about. It's just my culture and way of behavior that makes me like this.

EXACTLY. I guess I threw in too many details. I like anime the way it is and I just want MORE without having to read stupid subtitles. And without having to buy a million episodes in teh store. And without having to wait for just certain animes to be bought by CN. Maybe Im being greedy but hey I needs my anime and I needs more. Also having to stay up will 1:30 to watch my favorite shows on adult swim sucks too.

Also Meryl I dont think you should apologise if you offended anyone in your posts. You have every right to express yourself in any manner you deem fit . Id hate for you to sensor yourself too much and we not get the full effect of your stance on the issue. Also I think your a bit misguided in certain areas about americans. I dont know too many that think bad about asians. Sure thier are a few as Preventer stated that are racist but I think every nation has thier fair share of those. I think if a good effort to introduce the U.S to Anime was made it would be a succes. Sure it might be HUGE at first and then die down but everything on television does that. Look at these retarted Reality shows they will dwindle down . Hell Spunge Bob Square Pants was HUGE here in the U.S for a while and now I dont hear much about that. Its just that americans tend to go over board with things at first untill something else comes along. But the things of interest dont completely die. I mean, I still know kids who Like/Love Pokemon even though its not HALF as big as it used to be. And CN just bought a bunch of new episodes and are airing them .